Episode 22: The Real Reasons You're Not Marketing Yourself: A Bumper Solstice Episode
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In this special solstice episode, Claire and Lauren reunite behind the microphone for the first time in a year to explore a topic that so many coaches, practitioners and business owners quietly wrestle with: what is really stopping us from putting ourselves out there?
Using the winter and summer solstice as a moment of reflection, they answer real questions submitted by the Cycle Coach School community about visibility, imposter syndrome, social media, fear of judgement, creative overwhelm, and the vulnerability of sharing your work with the world.
Together, they unpack how many of our marketing struggles aren't really about algorithms or content strategies at all—they're about identity, nervous system safety, perfectionism, and the deeply human desire to belong. Claire shares how she's been rethinking her own relationship with marketing, while Lauren reflects on returning to work after maternity leave and how becoming a mother has reshaped her creativity, priorities, and relationship with visibility.
The conversation explores what it means to market your work in a way that feels authentic, sustainable, and aligned with your values, rather than forcing yourself into strategies that don't fit your personality or season of life. They also discuss the importance of community, long-form content, self-trust, and allowing your business to evolve alongside you.
Whether you're just beginning your coaching journey or have been running your business for years, this episode offers a reassuring reminder that you're not alone if being seen feels uncomfortable, and that your unique voice is exactly what makes your work valuable.
Click play to explore how to move through the fears that keep you hidden, reconnect with your message, and step into the next season of your business with more confidence, creativity and self-compassion.
Resources and Links:
Cycle Coach School Website:www.cyclecoachtraining.com
Cycle Coach Instagram: @cyclecoachschool
Claire's Instagram: @_clairebaker_
Claire's Website:www.clairebaker.com
Lauren's Instagram:@laurenoliviahughes
Lauren's Website:www.findingjulian.com
Claire (00:50)
Welcome back to the Cycle Coach Show. I'm so excited for this episode because you've got me and you've got Lauren together. Finally!
Lauren (01:00)
Yay, reunited.
Claire (01:02)
When did we last record a podcast episode together?
Lauren (01:06)
I think it was probably like one year ago, was it not? Because it would have been before baby for me.
Claire (01:09)
Mm. Could be.
You're right. Yeah. It was probably the solstice last year, and this is our special annual, well, biannual, I suppose, solstice episode. And it's the winter solstice for me because I'm currently in Australia, which is one of the reasons why we haven't been recording podcast episodes together, because the time zone from Sydney to Edinburgh is rough and you're back from maternity leave. ⁓
Lauren (01:16)
So I think it was probably June.
Yeah.
Claire (01:45)
And you're in the summer solstice. So how is it feeling with all that light in your day right now?
Lauren (01:50)
It's feeling disorienting. There's been a couple nights this week, I'm embarrassed to say that it's been like ten PM and then my husband and I are looking at each other being like, we have to put the baby to bed 'cause it's just like daylight outside and we're just like both ADD, like like distracted by the I don't know, whatever we're doing at the time. ⁓ and then in the morning, yeah, just trying to block the light from her so that she doesn't wake up too early. 'Cause it's just, yeah, so sunny and bright
⁓ yeah, it's nice to be kind of back in this season. It feels very familiar and also a bit nostalgic 'cause we're approaching her first her first birthday. So I'm just like,
Claire (02:27)
Mm.
Yeah,
that's right, because the last time we recorded together, you were about you were just about to go on leave to have Agatha and now she's about to turn one, which is amazing. Well done, you. You've kept a little human alive for nearly an entire year and you're easing back into some work. What's it been like transitioning back into that part of life again?
Lauren (02:41)
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. No.
Mm-hmm.
it's been very, I mean, gentle. I have not done very much just because it's been limited to one day a week. As Hector and I kind of navigate our plans. Nursery here is astronomically expensive. ⁓ and so it's just, yeah, two self-employed individuals kind of staring at each other being like, hmm, what's the plan? But it's been just nice to, you know, step back in with this podcast and have conversations. I've had
Claire (03:22)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (03:28)
I recorded two already. I'm doing another this afternoon and it's just nice to like feel like I'm back in the world and feel like I'm yeah, reconnecting with this part of my life that I enjoy so much outside of motherhood, right? So yeah.
Claire (03:43)
it's so good for ⁓
us to have you back as well, even if it is just one day a week, because Lauren ⁓ supports me in marking our assessments for everybody who's going through certification. So that's really nice having having your eyes on on all of the ⁓ submissions coming through. And then of course getting to do the podcast together again has been really fun. And
Lauren (03:46)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Claire (04:07)
Yeah, I just bow down like in awe of all mothers who are still able to can like tend to their creative fire and projects in whatever like ratio that looks like. And I think you're doing amazingly well. Lauren wrote the most beautiful substuck piece this last week that really moved me to tears as well on on postpartum life that I will link in the show notes. So it's it's awesome to just see like reblossoming into some of your cr other creative dimensions as well.
Lauren (04:19)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Yeah. And it it's it's nice when you don't have a lot of time because then we'll probably get into this theme in this episode, but when you don't have a lot of time, it's almost like that Crone menstruation energy of just being like, Well, what do I actually want to do? Like, let's just like cut out everything that doesn't matter to me. And so it's been really beautiful to just like have space to write and to kind of let that lead me out of the darkness of postpartum to like, okay, like
Claire (04:52)
Mm.
Lauren (05:06)
I don't know where I'm going or how this business will evolve with my capacity, but I've always been a writer first and foremost. So it's just been nice to lean into that and just allow that to be enough for now.
Claire (05:20)
Yeah, man's sister. It's awesome. I was just thinking, we would normally start with a cycle check-in, but neither of us really have a menstrual cycle right now. Funny.
Lauren (05:21)
Okay.
Well, we
could just check in and say like what phase are we resonating with or is there like yeah, check in with your body and not the day.
Claire (05:37)
Love that.
Love that.
Plus, it's a new moon on the day that we're recording this as well. I would say today, ⁓ and and just for context, the reason why I don't have a menstrual cycle at the moment is because I'm going through IVF. So that's why. And it's been really interesting actually, because it's nearly been a full year of various incarnations of like medicated cycles for me.
Lauren (05:45)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Claire (06:10)
⁓ so it's kind of been a year of not really having a natural menstrual cycle, which has been an interesting experiment. ⁓ and I have to say I miss the ups and the downs. I really do. I really do. But it's been okay and it's been a really great insight, I would say, into what it's like to potentially be post-menopausal or to be postpartum like you are right now and not be menstruating again. And there's been so many times in my career that I've sat across from women who feel a bit lost at sea without their cycle. And so
It's been a good experience for me to navigate that actually as well. And I do I will say the lunar cycle has been a great handrail for me, a framework to lean into. So yeah, on this new moon, I'm feeling really buoyant. I j I feel like something has shifted in the last few weeks, honestly, even the last few days, just in my energy and it almost feels like a new year. And I suppose it is in a way being in the winter solstice.
It does really feel almost like the second half of this year. I'm looking at it as if it were the beginning of a year. It's it's been a bit of a journey for me to adjust to the seasons being flipped since I've been back in Australia and I'm still figuring out how it looks with my working rhythm in the year and this and winter being now, because it does feel like a beginning, even though we're in June.
So yeah, I am feeling great. I'm really excited to be here with you and and sharing on the topic today, which we'll get into in just a moment. But we're gonna really workshop a lot around marketing and what is holding us all back ⁓ from really being seen and being visible and sharing our voices online and our message. But before we get into that, how would you check in with your
cyclic experience today as a postpartum woman.
Lauren (08:04)
Mm, yeah. I mean, it's been interesting because I haven't been actively charting, of course, but I still definitely do notice there's some sort of cycle happening in my body where I notice it, especially in relation to my partner, where there's weeks where I'm like, ⁓ couldn't get enough of him, and then other weeks where I'm like, I think I might murder him. I think I might just like this might just be the end for Hector. I don't know. We'll see. so it's been interesting, but today with this new moon.
Interestingly enough, I feel like almost like a cycle day two where I'm like quite tired of my body. Like I've had a very busy weekend with like baby stuff and just very full on. But there's like that calm that I get when I'm bleeding. Like I find at the end of my luteal phase, it's like I'm like itching to rest. And then cycle day two, I'm usually like on a cloud a little bit. And so that's how I feel. I feel a bit like I'm
Claire (09:00)
Mm.
Lauren (09:02)
Mentally on a cloud where I'm just like, okay, there's things I have to do today. They'll they'll get done. But like it's just like I'm gonna be just floating through. yeah. It's been interesting to not have a cycle for nearly two years, I guess, would be in September, would be my two year anniversary of no cycle. And I do really miss it because some of my mom friends are getting them back and then I just feel like a bit of a nerd being like, Do they feel different? And they're like, Yeah.
Tell me more without being creepy. Tell me everything about your period. And yeah, so I'm I am genuinely excited to like get mine back. But we've moved we moved last year while I was pregnant. So then the other day I was like, Where is my cup? Where is like where are my period anywhere? I'm like, I know I'm sh I I put them somewhere like very special, I'm sure, but I have to go looking for them 'cause I don't think, yeah, the when it finally comes back won't be the time to find them, you know?
Claire (09:37)
Ha ha ha ha ha.
⁓
Lauren (10:01)
Yeah.
Claire (10:03)
I hear you,
I hear you. When when we left the UK I actually ⁓ disposed of all of my reusable pads and my cup because to be honest, they were at the end of their life and they needed replacing. But because we'd been ⁓ trying to get pregnant, I didn't buy any more out of like hope and optimism that I wouldn't need them. And I haven't really needed them, although there have been periods over the last year where I have had bleeds, not really periods, but like withdrawal bleeds.
And I finally I finally got some. I finally got some reusable pads the other day. and it's nice to have some fresh ones, actually, I will say. It is nice.
Lauren (10:40)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. No, I was
looking at like yeah, getting some new period underwear maybe 'cause I like I have a few pairs. They're just like, you know, I you could always use more as well. And it's just like, ⁓ yeah, might be time. Treat myself.
Claire (10:49)
Uh-huh.
Treat yourself, girlfriend. I love that. I wonder when your blood will return.
Lauren (11:03)
I'll let you know.
Claire (11:05)
Hmm. Mm-hmm. I'm sure you will.
I can't wait. ⁓
so we have got I mean, I asked okay, so I I got onto ⁓ our Instagram stories the other day on our cycle coach school account and I asked you all what is holding you back in your marketing? Like what is stopping you from showing up and being visible online and you really delivered. ⁓
I asked the question because honestly, it's something that I'm currently examining within myself. And I often find when there's something that I'm navigating, it turns out everyone else is navigating it. That's sort of how it works. It shows up in client sessions, it shows up in conversations. I love that we're all collectively thinking about the same stuff, which means that we can all help each other because if I'm grappling with something, probably you are as well. And that's cool.
'cause we can be really honest about it. So I wanted to workshop. Lauren and I are going to workshop these questions, these fears and blocks. these fears and blocks that are holding you back from being visible in your marketing.
And because it's the solstice, we're gonna tie it into that because this is such a powerful moment in the year to pause, whether it's winter or summer, and to reflect on the last six months, to reflect on the last 12 months, and to reorient yourself for the season to come and to think about you know what's ahead and really ground in.
And celebrate yourself and take some time to renourish ⁓ and recharge whatever it is that you require. And I and I just think that right now, especially as AI gains whatever it's gaining, you know, as as it just continues to like seep into our lives. I know that there is a lot of fear and a lot of questions around how this is going to impact business owners and folks who work in copywriting and marketing and social media. And I've gotta say that I
think the more generic everyone is sounding and smoothed out and perfect, then actually the better chance we have to be to really be noticed and to stand out if we bring our full selves ⁓ and our whole messy imperfect selves to it. And and that can feel really scary actually. I think it can be really easy to hide behind ⁓ AI. So I I really want to get into this today. Like what is it that is really
underneath these fears of showing up in our marketing. Shall we dive into the first?
Lauren (13:58)
Yeah, let's do it.
Claire (13:59)
I've changed names just for privacy's sake, but you'll know it's you when you hear your question. And I and I hope that even if you didn't ask this question, ⁓ that you resonate with what we share today because like I said, we're, you know, it's so normal and so common to have fears around ⁓ marketing oneself. Our first question comes from Belinda.
And Belinda says, I don't promote my work enough because I fear that it and me is not good enough.
Lauren (14:35)
Hmm. Mm-hmm. Well, I think I don't want to speak for you, Claire, but I I we were chatting about it before we hit record, and we were both kind of saying how some of these questions were quite confronting because it's like, ⁓ are you reading my diary? A number of times I've like felt that way of yeah, just waiting for someone to kind of
Claire (14:51)
Yeah.
Lauren (15:01)
point and say, You're not good enough, or you shouldn't be teaching this, or you're wrong. and I think it kind of does come to the like nature of being online. I was thinking about this the other day with a friend and it's like the arguments you have online in a comment section, you would never have like at a coffee shop or like
Claire (15:04)
Mm.
Mm.
Lauren (15:23)
I think of you like teaching at your church, and it's just like, you know, you can have disagreements and then you're just still at the dinner table being like, interesting that you think that. Okay. And we're still gonna share a meal. And so it can just feel a bit all or nothing, or quite black and white, when yeah, I don't think that there is as much of a spotlight on us as we feel sometimes. I think
Claire (15:47)
Mm Mm.
Lauren (15:49)
we think ab obviously we think about ourselves more than other people think about ourselves.
Claire (15:55)
Yeah. And it can feel like yeah, the spotlight and yeah, the spotlight can feel so
Even just thinking about it, like gives me like a tingly feeling in my body of just that overexposure, like really feeling like very vulnerable, very stripped back. And and I really think that there is something in all of these questions, honestly, that really ties into like safety and nervous system capacity. ⁓ it's often not about the marketing fear itself. It's often much more about like how safe do we feel.
How overexposed do we feel? And I can relate to this one, especially around the fear that
not it's it's just this yeah this I'm not good enough is like a fear around inadequacy and that my the visibility will expose some some inadequacy somewhere and that if I'm too yeah the spotlight is too much on me that I'll be judged and like you say the spot the spotlight is
Yeah, it's probably not shining on us as much as we think that it is. And I think there's a few questions that we can really get into with this one as well, because it's so common, this like
Lauren (17:06)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (17:14)
fear that what we have to offer and who we are isn't good enough. And I think that the first thing that comes to me is like something actually that Alexandra Pope talks about from Red School in regards to the inner critic, which is like there's probably five percent of truth in what the inner critic has to say. And if we can quieten down that voice and all of its drama and its
like extravagance, then actually there is probably maybe something in there that is worth listening to. And I often think about this with the with imposter syndrome. Like maybe there is a part of your offer that could be refined. Possibly there is a system that could be improved. It's very possible that you have some area of your offering that you could work on. That's really normal.
To have parts of our business, our product, our offering, our service, what we do that could be a little bit better. Like if we're really honest, probably there will always be something that that could be improved in some way. but that doesn't mean that your work isn't good enough to take it to market, right? Like that doesn't mean that it's not good enough.
Lauren (18:28)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I think that language of, you know, am I good enough? It's also sometimes in my mind then you fall into the trap of constantly taking more courses, doing more certifications, like being like, I need to know everything. And first off, like that's not possible. Like you don't have enough capacity to learn everything in the world. But like what a beautiful opportunity to lead with curiosity and to be like, maybe I don't know everything, but that's okay. Like
Claire (18:44)
Yeah.
Lauren (19:01)
Nobody's expecting you to. So you kind of have to remove that pressure from yourself a little bit, I would say. and allowing yourself to get started with what you have. and I mean in our industry as well, like even like scientists, doctors, and not that they're like, you know, I always see them above us, but it's just like they don't even know all the answers. So like so what are we trying to do? Like just
Claire (19:26)
Mm, mm,
mm.
Lauren (19:29)
Yeah,
once again, like stepping off the internet and talking to the average person, saying you're a menstrual cycle coach, they don't know what that is. And they probably don't even know what the four phases are. You know what I mean? So it's like let's take a breath, catch the breath.
Claire (19:43)
Absolutely. I was just thinking that, yeah, how many people around
us could really name like what the follicular phase is and what the lithium phase is? I think quite a small percentage, actually. and you're reminding me of your conversation that you had with Nat Daudet in a recent podcast episode where I think you both spoke so beautifully and frankly about the fact that we don't have to know everything and like.
Expert. Being an expert doesn't mean that you know everything either. and that's totally okay. I I really have a lot of compassion for this question because I myself can really succumb to like perfectionistic tendencies, and this won't be a surprise that this isn't the first time this you know the threads of perfectionism come up in these questions either. I think that perfectionism can really hold a lot of us back.
When it comes to showing up and just letting something be good enough. This is something that my my god, my fiance Adam is so good at. It's just like, it's good enough. Like, yep, cool, it's good enough. Like, next, it's good enough. And ⁓ it's so inspiring for me. And I, and if I'm honest, I find that difficult because I have that same like need for control that.
can often hold me back from just letting something be good enough. And so I think a really great question that I would offer you, Belinda, is what would good enough actually look like for you, for your offer? I've had to ask this so many times to myself, like, what would good enough actually be? At what point would I feel like, yep, this is good enough? And are we already there? Like, is that standard realistic? It's okay to have standards. I have
I have high standards for myself and my work and it's something that I pride myself on. But there's a difference between having standards and needing something to be perfect because that is impossible. And if we're always aiming for perfection, we're never gonna get there and we're never gonna take our product or our service to market.
And ⁓ man, it's so tough. I really have a lot of compassion for this one.
Lauren (21:56)
Yeah, I'd also add just I mean, you touched on it, but having that support system, having that community. Like you have your fiance, like my husband Hector. I have some like trusted friends that like I can chat with about business. But it's like even Hector does such a beautiful job of holding me. Like after I do a circle, like I always I think he knows now. I come out and I'm on such a high, and then like 10 minutes later, it's like a crash, and I'm just like,
I don't know if they liked it. Like, do you think they and he's just like, You just said they're like, you know what I mean? He's just like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. And so it's just like having someone that you can actually like discuss these things with, or is it like a friend that you're inviting into these group offerings that can like just help you like ground yourself a little bit to be like, no, it was amazing. Like just it to build that muscle until you can kind of stand on your own. But I think sometimes as a self employed person, you're like, I have to do it all alone.
Claire (22:30)
Yeah.
Lauren (22:53)
And it's just like, no, no, no, no, no. That's not how we bet work best. Like, use your people. ⁓ and just like, yeah, don't don't be afraid to lean on others when you're feeling 'cause yeah, I literally have a necklace that says, I am enough. It's just like constantly being like, So having those people like to reflect back to you and remind you of who you are is everything.
Claire (23:04)
Yeah.
Yes.
my gosh. to reflect to Yes.
I mean, this is something I I'm sure you see it as well in the assessment submissions when people are reflecting on their peer group supervision, just how helpful it is to hear from other coaches and practitioners working in a similar industry to realize, all right, okay, everybody else, you know, often struggles with this feeling of of not being enough and tying our
like our self-worth as a human to the the products that we're offering, which is always going to end up, you know, get a bit get a bit tangled and a little bit complicated. yeah, like worthiness tied to being an expert in something. And and we're gonna get there's another couple of questions that are coming up that I think really get into this as well, but just how willing are we to let ourselves be in the phase that we're in? Like
Are we comparing the current phase of our career, which might be an early stage where there is actually plenty of room for improvement because that's just the natural order of things? Are you comparing where you are as a beginner coach, possibly, to someone who's had 10 years of experience? Because that's not going to be a fun time, if that's
Lauren (24:37)
That's exclusively what I do.
Look at this person who is award winning just
Claire (24:41)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. And look, I really want to celebrate the the high standard girlies. Like, let's have let's absolutely strive for excellence in our work. I'm all for that. But you're right. Having peers, having someone to give you honest feedback, looking at what could potentially be adjusted and being okay with with that, getting better at receiving constructive criticism as well, I think has really helped me here and recognizing, yeah, cool, there's some stuff that could be changed. That doesn't mean that.
Lauren (24:45)
Yes.
Claire (25:13)
the product isn't worthy of going to market. That doesn't mean that it's bad or that I am bad. There's just a bit of room for improvement. But it's it's overall pretty good. Like, yeah.
Lauren (25:21)
Yeah.
And nothing nothing is set
in stone. The offering that you launch right now, next time you launch it, you can tweak it, you can change it. I think sometimes we're like it has to be perfect, which is I know it w one of the next questions. So
Claire (25:38)
Yeah, let's get into the next one. So, Belinda, thanks for asking that great question. I hope that was helpful. Lisa says, I don't have a lot of client experience. So I don't feel confident promoting my coaching. So this follows on really nicely. So we're speaking right now to someone who is a recent grad of just starting out in their coaching journey and they're having trouble, yeah, feeling confident promoting what they do because the truth is they haven't done a lot of it.
Lauren (26:04)
Mm-hmm. Mm. Yeah. I think my first thought goes to I know through the certification pro process there is like that practice client opportunity. And it's like sometimes I think I know for me I was just like, and now I'm a professional. So now I have to have like a professional offering. And it's like, but do you? Like you could do you want more practice clients? Or like I know for myself, I paired up with a fellow cycle coach.
graduate and we just like I think for like a full year, we met every week. We just would swap, like one week she would hold me, the next week I would hold her. And it was just like it was great business-wise, like for coaching and receiving that support, but also it was great practice to be like, okay, like I actually can hold the space. And I think there was that pressure to be like, I need to know everything, I need to have every answer.
and then when you go through the training, I remember listening to one of your sessions that you do with a client. And I'm like, she really just she you do ask great questions and you do teach like at incredible moments. It is like, you know, awe-inspiring, of course. And then I was still like shocked by the amount of silence there was of just holding that container and just like having that reminder of, you know, when I'm in a session and someone's just holding space, like I could talk for a full hour.
And like that feels really good for me. So just like having a reminder of like, you know, like holding that space. Like that is that is the job. It's just like protecting that boundary. ⁓ and like if you want to build that muscle, then do, but don't feel like it's like, you know, you're having to like do a university lecture on this topic every hour because that's not where the magic lives, in my experience, at least.
Claire (27:29)
Only.
Yeah. Mm.
Mm.
Mm. Yeah.
Lauren (27:58)
It's in those like unexpected twists of like, ⁓ I didn't think we'd end up here, but how wonderful. Yeah.
Claire (27:58)
Yeah, I really
Yeah, absolutely.
And I really hear what you're saying is the importance of of practice to build confidence. And those moments when you are practicing with someone or you're in an you're in one of those early sessions with a client, and like you say, you have that moment of like, ooh, okay, like something's happening.
I'm getting great insights here, or I'm asking a great question, or there's silence that leads to an outcome, or if it's feeling really good. I think we've got to really drink those in, like drink them in. Research tells us that we, you know, we know that we pay way more attention to criticism than we do to positive feedback as humans. That's just how we're wired. So I think it's really good practice for all of us as practitioners to spend time after a
workshop like you've done with Hector, your husband, or after holding a coaching session or in a peer supervision session or with your supervisor to really reflect, or just in your journal after a coaching session, on what went really well. Like what went well and what felt good in your body and what can you celebrate about how you held space? Now of course we also want to take time to again reflect on the things that we could do differently next time or that we could improve upon and start to get used to like
I think it's like so much of this is nervous system work, isn't it? It's like getting used to like being able to be gently critical of our own work as practitioners and receiving that critical feedback without succumbing to like the depths of I'm not good enough. And also getting really good at celebrating our wins and noticing when something goes well. So yeah, practice really helps so much for a beginner coach, for all coaches.
and I think we have to shift this belief that we need to have that confidence intact or built before we go out and and see clients and and practice when actually it comes through the practicing. So that's I would really encourage Lisa here to like just examine that belief that she needs to have the confidence before seeing clients and before marketing herself.
It will come through through the talking about what you're doing, which is really all that marketing is, and through talking about it, through having conversations, through seeing clients. That's how you build confidence.
Lauren (30:30)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. And like once again, allowing this whole experience to be cyclical. It doesn't have to be linear. Like I know for myself, you know, I started out and was like, I'm gonna do group stuff. And now I'm like, well, maybe I wanna do more one on one. And then being like, maybe I wanna take on practice clients because I'm like reshifting my focus of the business and like, you know, that feels vulnerable. And so I'm like, maybe I do want to like, you know, lower that pressure of like the exchange and just
Claire (30:47)
Mm.
Mm.
Lauren (31:01)
Yeah, just allowing that curiosity and that playfulness show up in your business. I think we can be so serious and so like I have to be professional. Has to be like And yes, we do need to be professional, of course. But allowing a bit of humanness to enter your business and allowing it to be like a bit, yeah, experimental at times. I think it's fun.
Claire (31:09)
Yeah.
And think allowing yourself to be where you are. So have a think about where you are in the season, you know, in the cycle of your coaching journey. So if you are a beginner coach, then you're probably in a spring phase of your career. And that's that's really exciting. It's like that blossoming, emerging energy. And we know can also be very tender time as well and very vulnerable. And we don't want to like
Lauren (31:26)
Nice.
Claire (31:50)
Trample all over the beautiful seeds that are that are like sprouting forth right now by by trying to go from zero to 10. So just as we've learned as cyclic practitioners to pay attention to our cycle and to let the cycle wax and wane, are we inadvertently like trying to go from zero to 10 when we graduate from a coaching program and immediately expect ourselves to be, you know, at a 10 in our
career when we have to go through the process of of blossoming. So can you in your marketing be honest about that? Let yourself be someone who is growing and learning and in the spring phase and just talk about that. I think rather than pretending to be someone who's at a 10 or who's in the summer or the autumn phase of their career, right? That's not going to feel good if you're actually in spring, but you're pretending
Lauren (32:29)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (32:47)
To be in a more mature autumn. I know that when I started out seeing clients and like Lauren shared, I also did lots of practice swaps with people I had trained with. I was also blogging a lot at the time and I talked really openly about the fact that I was very new to this work and that helped a lot.
Lauren (32:47)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (33:10)
that just helped to free up some of the expectations that I worried people might have if I, you know, pretended to be something that I wasn't. It never feels good to pretend to be in a season that we're not in. So that would also be my suggestion for Lisa as well.
Lauren (33:26)
Hmm. Thanks, Lisa.
Claire (33:27)
All right.
Thanks, Lisa. So good. And I'm sure there's going to be so many people who resonate with that question. Following along on this theme of not feeling good enough, Anna has brought to the table the fear of being judged or criticized by others for not knowing enough. so again, this imposter syndrome coming through and worrying.
You know, I'm imagining that there might be a fear of like maybe being in a client session and someone asks you something that you don't have all the answers for, or maybe someone criticizing you online because there's an area of women's health that you don't have all of the data on as an example. What could be some other examples do you think, Lauren, of like where that fear of being judged or criticized might come up?
Lauren (34:23)
Yeah. For me, what I felt in my body was like showing up on social media and like launching new offerings and like that vulnerable season of a launch. or even just like posting content that maybe feels new to you, like a bit more educational, a bit more like Yeah, I just you're you're kind of showing up on on reels, maybe. And it's just there and it's almost like a two part for me in my body where there's that fear of like
Claire (34:47)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (34:54)
being judged by friends and family who know like a version of me. And so maybe this is like different. and they're like, what do you what is she doing? What is what's what's she trying to do? right before you have that success, there's a lot of like attempts and failures. and then on the flip side, there's your peers. and I went through the first year of cycle coach school. So we talked earlier about not comparing yourself to people who are like further down the path than you. But like
In my year, there's just so many like titans of industry in my mind that like incredible women who have like established businesses and who have since exploded in beautiful ways. And then there's me who like, you know, on a different path completely, of course. But like it's it's just hard not to be like, I wonder what they think of like this attempt, or like, you know what I mean? And like I I don't think they're sitting there being like,
Claire (35:43)
Mm.
Lauren (35:48)
yes, Lauren. Look at her, look at her try again. And but like there is just like that feeling of like wanting to be accepted by your peers, wanting to be like seen and celebrated by your friends and family. in a season where maybe you're still experimenting, you're still finding what feels good because I know from experience, like the first few years you are kind of experimenting with like, does this feel good? Like
Do I wanna like appeal to these people? Like what I don't know. Like it's it's hard to feel confident when you're so vulnerable ⁓ in that season of finding I don't even wanna say niche 'cause but like but finding what really like sets your soul on fire, you know? it it can be a lot to take in as one person.
Claire (36:20)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think it's really worth being like naming again, like this nervous system piece and the belonging that is r a really natural, normal human d need. Like we all feel that need to belong and to be accepted and to be liked and to be like affirmed. Like these are all really normal things. And so I think we can all have a lot of compassion for our I hope that we can have compassion for ourselves in these questions.
As well. And I and I also just really want to celebrate everybody for naming them honestly, because like I hear every single one of these questions and I get it. I get every single one. Like saying to Lauren as I was going through the Melli, I felt a bit nauseous because I know how all of these feel. and I and I really know this one. I really know this fear of overexposure or feeling like I need to have all of the answers.
Lauren (37:39)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (37:39)
Which I think is what is really underneath this fear. So a couple of things that I can say to this, and I did this literally today, because we're currently enrolling for the final intake for certification for folks who want to be certified by the end of the year. So I'm I'm in like launch mode. something that comes up for me a lot when I'm promoting the training is a fear that people
Are going to misunderstand what it is that we do. Over the last like five or six years, six years, seven years nearly, since we've been running cycle coach school, there've been a whole lot of new trainings emerge that didn't exist before. Some of them are very similar to what we do, but not quite exactly what we do. And there like there's some that really focus on hormone health, for example. They really get into the like the bio more of the biology.
Lauren (38:30)
Mm.
Claire (38:34)
and and the hormonal side of things or even like the fit like the fertility side of things, right? Now, we cover a little bit of that in the training. Of course, we get into the like, you know, the 101 of of the menstrual cycle and what's actually happening in the female body. But we don't stay there for long.
A lot of what we do here at Psycho Coach School is working on more like the psychospiritual aspects of it and helping women chart their cycle so that they can integrate it into other dimensions of their life. And it's more about working with the menstrual cycle, I would say, than than working on period problems. And I have a fear a lot of the time that people misunderstand me and my work in general, that people are going to accuse me of I fear I have this fear of being judged if I don't know like.
endometriosis inside out, for example. or if I don't know like menopause inside out, or if I'm not an expert on name, you know, insert, female health experience, menarch. right. So I know quite a bit about all of these things, but I don't know everything about all of these things. And so I find it really helpful to get clear on what it is that I do do. Like who is this for?
This product and this offering, what do I help them with? Like, what does this training transform in them and enable them to do? What does my work inspire, educate, empower, embody women to go out and do in the world? And what is it not about as well? And I actually think that that clarity can help so much because if we have a fear that we have to, if we have a belief that we have to know everything about everything when it comes to the female body, like,
There's no one on the planet that could speak to every dimension of the female experience. And so I think being clear on like what is what lane are we swimming in, I think can be really helpful as well with this one.
Lauren (40:31)
Hmm. And I'm curious to know because I f feel as I feel you you started your business at the very like beginning. I I mean obviously there were people before you, experts before you, but it just feels like you were kind of like welcoming a lot of us into the industry. So how does that feel having to maybe adjust the way you market yourself or you know, having more exposure, whereas like
Claire (40:45)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (40:58)
before you could just be like, I'm a period coach and now there is so much nuance to even what that phrase could mean. How has that kind of evolved over your career?
Claire (41:01)
Mm.
Mm. Yeah.
Yeah. I think that the trickiest time for me with this, for this fear of being judged and criticized and misunderstood, I have a really big fear of being misunderstood in general in my life, but was publishing my book. I think when 50 Things You Need to Know About Periods came out, I'm just literally looking at it right now because it's on my desk. And I was like, I the the tagline for this book, like whatever you call it, the subtitle.
Lauren (41:18)
Mm-hmm.
Well
Claire (41:39)
Is know your flow and live in sync with your cycle. And I was just so adamant that that needed to be on there because I was just so worried that people would really misunderstand what the book was about because it had the word like periods on it in big letters. Now the publisher wanted that was a title that they wanted to go with. And for anyone who's published in traditional publishing, like, you know, there's some choices you get to make and there's plenty that you don't. And that was one that they went with. And
I just remember being like, I need to have on there, like know your flow and live in sync with your cycle. Because that to me felt like it communicated more of what my work is is actually about. And I found that really tough because I gained, I did get a lot of exposure when that book came out. I think like my, you know, my yeah, the amount of eyes on my work, like double, tripled in a very short space of time.
And it's true that there were a lot of people who came to me to into my universe who didn't want what I was actually selling. Like they wanted something else. They and and and that's okay. Like I think that was tricky for me at that time because I did have this fear of like, God, I've got to now somehow like be someone I'm not and have answers to things that I don't have answers to because I'm not a doctor.
But again, like this c like it's just this constant process, I think, of refining. Okay, well then who am I for? What is it that I do? And my God, it's tough. It's tough, but it's so necessary in business to keep refining and checking in with ourselves too. Like, does that still feel relevant? Does that title, yeah, period coach, does that still feel good? Does that still really communicate what I do? And
It's such an evolution, this one.
Lauren (43:33)
Mm-hmm.
Our next question is from Clara and she wrote, Worried that if I get too busy I won't be able to handle it and will let people down or burn out.
Claire (43:45)
Hmm. my god, I know this one. Wow. This is this feels personal.
Lauren (43:53)
Claire, are you Clara?
Claire (43:59)
It might appear so. I promise I'm not. No, ⁓ my god, I know this one so well.
Lauren (44:01)
Yeah.
Claire (44:08)
Yeah.
I think that as a highly sensitive person and as a woman who has high standards for myself and for the work that I deliver. And I'm pretty at peace with both of those things. I think by you know, I'm nearly 40, like I've I've figured out that's that's just who I am now. Like that's not gonna change. I'm always gonna be highly sensitive. I'm always gonna have the high standards for myself.
Therefore, I'm always, I think, gonna really resonate with this, with this fear, this block that I'm gonna get too busy, I'm gonna be too successful, success isn't gonna feel safe, I'm not gonna be able to handle it, I'm gonna let people down, people are gonna be upset, or I'm going to, I'm gonna burn out. Like more is too much, and success feels less safe ⁓ and actually more difficult in a way than than failure.
this is such a sneaky one. And for me, it's really, yeah. It's for me, it's really about being honest with myself about my capacity. Like, what is my true capacity right now? What season of life am I in? Is it a season of consolidating, refining, going a little quieter, keeping things a bit more streamlined? That's okay, that's normal, that happens.
Or is it a season of expanding, growing, scaling, reaching more people, being more seen and being more visible? And again, to come back to the seasonal analogy, I think that it can really help us here to just be honest about what season of life am I in, and therefore what season of my business am I in. However, this protective this this block can feel like you're really protecting yourself. And for a while it might be, it might be protecting you.
It probably has been protecting you. You might have like gone into this mode after an especially stressful or intense phase of life. That's that's me, definitely. At some point, though, it stops being protective. At some point, that voice that's like, stay small, stay small, stay small, can actually be really holding us back and and and actually causing more problems. Like a question that I would have ⁓ that I ask myself is.
What evidence do you actually have that growth will automatically lead to burnout? Like, is there any evidence for this belief? Because that's really what's underneath this is that getting bigger and growing and being seen is going to lead to burnout. Do you have evidence for this and and just being with that, talking that through like through with someone, figuring out what season you are actually in right now? Because the truth is you might not have capacity to take on.
Lauren (46:41)
⁓
Claire (47:03)
10 clients right now. It might be two. And I think being really honest with ourselves about the capacity is so important. we don't want to overextend ourselves, but like I said, sometimes that protective mechanism can actually be really blocking us. Because another question here is like, is staying small actually a proven burnout prevention strategy? Because I know for myself that actually.
Earning more money and having more revenue and having a a growing, thriving, successful business actually creates a lot of ease in my life. Having very little money and being very stressed about work all the time often it means I'm still working the same amount of hours as I would if I was if I was earning more money and reaching more people and having, you know, a really a thriving business. So yeah, I think it's really important for us to get clear on like what
Lauren (47:55)
Mm.
Claire (48:02)
What kind of business are we actually creating? What season are we in? And
Lauren (48:05)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (48:06)
What's right for us, you know, won't it it's and it's so unique, is so unique for us as well. But more doesn't always equal like bad.
Lauren (48:10)
Hmm. Yeah. I love that person
No, no. And that's like that whole phrase of like money can't buy you happiness. And it's like, well, yes, it can. It absolutely can. Like the people who say that have a lot of money probably. but it can, you know, afford you support. It can afford you. I just even think of like, I think of like Nat Daudet during her launches and she'll like go get massages and she'll like, you know, she like creates those like pockets of comfort in her launches. It's like,
Claire (48:42)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (48:47)
Yeah, you can afford to do that when you're like have a successful business. That's a great thing. but I love this perspective of what season are you in? And I think that's a really key question, especially like if you are potentially comparing yourself to where other people are. And I think of the podcast episode you recorded with Fienda. And I also think of Sonat Doday and ⁓ Lucia of Ambrosia's Table, the two of them.
Claire (48:50)
Mm.
Lauren (49:15)
I don't know if you listen to any of their podcasts. They recorded a podcast together and they're kind of like holding each other accountable. And so, like, I listen to podcasts all the time when I'm with Agatha, just because it's like nice to have voices in the room that aren't my own. and I just remember listening to the two of them and then the two of you and being like, Okay, yeah, I'm gonna get my business going. I'm gonna do this stuff. And I was listening to you and Vienna talk about ⁓ that like business bundle that you were doing in the spring. And I was like, Yeah. And then there was a question towards the end where you were.
Claire (49:19)
Mm.
Mm.
Lauren (49:45)
I think it was you who answered it and you're like, Do you have the time to commit to this? And I was like, Wow, okay.
Claire (49:52)
Ha ha ha.
Lauren (49:54)
I was like, let me get my business thriving. And then I was like, great, yeah, take a take a breath, Lauren. okay, got it. it's a bit of like, what is your capacity right now? but I also think it is a bit of like that we've been talking a lot about the nervous system because when I read that question, I was immediately transported to my previous career, which was in real estate. And the reason I left it was because I was so burnt out. I was just anxious all the time.
Claire (50:21)
Mm.
Lauren (50:23)
And I did make good money and I I missed the money. But then so there is that like having to retrain my body that like that was a different business. That was someone else's business that I was working in. And like what you create, it doesn't have to be out of control in that way. And if it is, like, you know, you can step off like the roller coaster to a certain extent. I mean, we are fortunate to be in a business that, like, yes, you gotta be professional, you have to like have.
You have to show up. and I think there is a bit of spaciousness. Like I have seen people kind of work into their contracts, like, you know, menstruation clause of like if I'm bleeding, I might not show up. Like, you know, we'll reschedule or whatever it might be. And just kind of recognizing that we are trying to build like a new world order through this work. Like that's I I think, yeah, the other day you shared some testimonials and it was just I think.
Claire (51:03)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Lauren (51:22)
It was I think I wrote it like five years ago and I mentioned like the matriarchal revolution and I was like, glad to know that I'm still on theme for like my goal of this work. But it's just it is like meant to be different and that burnout doesn't need to be part of the narrative. And so I need to reprogram my brain, my body. So maybe this is similar work that Clara or Claire, whoever it was, has to we will never know. No, but has to do as well just being like
Claire (51:29)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Hmm.
Lauren (51:52)
Yeah, what you create doesn't need to be like a Frankenstein's monster situation. It can be so spacious. Like I really love how, you know, I know you take like months off Instagram or take months off your business even. ⁓ and even I was chatting with someone about astrology and human design the other day and she's like, Yeah, your twelfth house month, like I just take it off. And I was like, ⁓ that's so nice to know. Like that's Capricorn season for me. And I was like,
Claire (51:58)
Mm.
Mm.
Hm, cool.
Lauren (52:21)
That's why I don't like working in that month. She's like, Don't bother. Like, okay. Like, you know, there's just so many like beautiful ways to build a business now that I think we can even be creative in that context to like carve out space to avoid that burnout, whether it is, you know, having a massage during your launch or taking a look off. ⁓ Yeah.
Claire (52:31)
⁓
Mm.
Yeah, there's something in here around self-trust, I think. Like, can we trust ourselves to erect this infrastructure in our businesses and in our year that is nourishing? Can we trust ourselves that when we're launching, that we will book a massage and ensure that we're not answering messages at 10 pm and then we're still getting enough sleep? Like
Lauren (52:48)
Mm-hmm. Yes.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Claire (53:11)
Can we trust ourselves to implement the systems that will actually really support us to scale and to reach more people and to have more eyes on us? that that, you know, doesn't result in us letting people down because we've we've put in the time to ⁓ get those systems sorted. So there's a real like, I think there's a real, yeah, there's so much humanness in this energy, in this question, sorry. And then I think like a real
I I sense a real opportunity to mature as well. Like there's a maturity here as well. And I think if we're thinking seasonally of of moving almost like from a spring right through a summer to autumn, it's like, okay, we're putting like, you know, our grown up like shoes or hat on here and we are going to create a business that is really going to support ourselves as much as it's supporting other people.
So that it can blossom and grow into like the summer of our business, but there's a real maturity as as well and like and refinement because guess what? It's gonna mean saying no to a lot of stuff. Like you're going to get to say yes to some clients and to some opportunities. There's gonna be a lot of things that you say no to as well if you wanna do this without burning yourself out. so practicing the your yes and then and then practicing your no. It's like flexing that summer and that that autumn ⁓ qualities. So love that question.
Lauren (54:33)
Yeah. And I think it
yeah. And I think it's just reminding yourself too that like a lot of us arrived at burnout because we were acting like we're in that summer phase all the time. Like a very masculine, like toxic masculine of like showing up all the time in that summary phase. And it's just like that's not who we are. So just a reminder that like you can refine as much as you need.
Claire (54:45)
Yep.
Yeah, like your sea your business gets to have seasons.
Lauren (55:03)
Mm-hmm. Mm. Yeah. Thank you, Clara.
Claire (55:05)
Your business gets to have seasons. All
right. Thanks, Clara. Eliza says, this is a good one. I hate feeling cringy. I think too much about what people think of me. Lauren, talk to me about cringe.
Lauren (55:20)
Hmm.
Claire (55:22)
Do you get this?
Lauren (55:23)
I mean,
cringe to who, first off. I I'm trying to think. I feel like I I don't know if I feel cringy, but I also grew up kind of pre social media. So like I'm of the era that we like, you know, would go out and then post a whole Facebook album of the night out.
Claire (55:35)
Mm.
Lauren (55:50)
Like, you know, with like a title and there'd be like, you know, bathroom floor pictures and just like, you know, so like I think it's like kind of built into like the marrow of my bones at this point. Like I we weren't we weren't cool online. Like there's no cool. so now it's like I feel a bit cringe if I'm trying to be too polished or like, you know, sometimes there's trends on reels and stuff, and I'm like, I can't.
Claire (55:58)
Totally.
You're a true millennial. Mm. Mm. yeah.
Lauren (56:18)
I can't contribute to that. Like I understand the mentality behind like, you know, hopping on a trend because then there's like more people to see you and all that stuff. But I'm just like, I just have to be myself. And yeah, I think like I I would feel cringe trying to like mimic someone else's energy. I think it's like that's been a big lesson for me and like.
Claire (56:39)
Mm.
Lauren (56:44)
We don't need to get into human design today, but just like noticing that my energy is different than someone else's. Like I mentioned Lucia earlier and I I feel like I talk about her all the time, but like her launches, like I would be dead after one day. Like you would not see me. Like 'cause she's just like, boom, so a lot. And like that, but that works for her. And then I I believe wholeheartedly that she would maintain that energy in any offering of hers. Whereas I'm like, I will show up once a month. It'll be magical.
Claire (56:50)
Mm.
Sure, yeah.
Lauren (57:12)
And then you won't see me again. Like just like I can't I can't can't I can't fake that. so for me that's like my version of cringe is if I'm trying to like we've talked about this earlier in the episode, trying to be someone who I'm not and trying to like put on a mask and being like, Hi everyone, like it just it feels fake for me. And then when I'm watching other people do it, it doesn't feel fake. Like, you know, it yeah, 'cause it feels true to them.
Claire (57:13)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Yeah.
Mm.
Mm.
Lauren (57:41)
So there is a bit of knowing yourself, I suppose.
Claire (57:46)
Yeah, that's good. I think that's really spot on. Knowing who you are, knowing ⁓ and practicing using your voice online in a way that feels natural for you. I think this is something I've definitely been practicing. more I mean, like you, I feel like I've been on the internet forever, but definitely in the last, I don't know, five or so years, just yeah, not putting on a mask or putting on
Lauren (58:13)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (58:15)
a voice or any a kind of energy that is simply just not who I am. I think it's also just getting older and I just don't have the I just can't do it anymore. there's something here that's very human. Like underneath this feeling of not wanting to feel cringe is a really normal human desire to be approved of and to belong again. Like
Really, really normal. I know that I would feel really cringy if I got on social media, for example, and like did I just refuse to do those pointy dances, you know, when everyone was like pointing at things all the time in reels. I was just like, that's never I'm never that's never gonna happen. No shade on anyone who did the pointy reels, but like I knew that if I tried to do that.
Lauren (59:03)
No.
Claire (59:08)
It would feel terrible and I w I wouldn't feel good to me. So I didn't do that. So you know, it's okay to have some boundaries as well.
Lauren (59:13)
I just I just love that you're like, I
could never dance in point and then meanwhile you're like in your underwear being like
Claire (59:19)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah,
absolutely. But yeah, but I can do that. Yeah, right. So it doesn't even have to make sense. ⁓
Lauren (59:28)
So fabulous. ⁓ but it I
Claire (59:30)
Yeah,
there's some things that I do that I'm sure other people would feel super cringy doing. Even writing, like some of the things that I know that I write about, like and and share, and maybe for you too. For some people that would feel really cringy. And I I guess it's probably worth you know examining what what cringe means to you. Like like you said, Lauren, like who are cringy according to whom? And also what do you mean by cringe? Because
Lauren (59:39)
Yeah.
Claire (59:57)
Is it embarrassing? Is it just that it feels not authentic? Is it just a bit edgy? Is it actually just completely like sacred? Something that you just don't want to do because it like, you know, there's certain there's plenty of things that I don't share online because they're they're sacred to me and they're not for the internet. yeah.
Lauren (1:00:18)
Well, and then I also wanted to touch on I recorded a podcast. It'll come out in July. So it's actually like we're working kind of backwards, forwards. but had this conversation with Katie U and and Hannah Pearn of Reflex East and Don't Tell Me to Relax. But they do so many reels online together. And so that was their kind of suggestion, 'cause I'm like, you guys are so incredible online. And they so to remove the cringe or just like that embarrassment or that fear of like
⁓ d like is this silly to post like to do it with a friend, then kind of removes that almost. And I'm like, I love that idea of just like, you know, if you can meet someone in person to do like a kind of a funny, cheeky reel with, amazing, or at least like having like a buddy that like you can run ideas by so that it just feels like it takes the pressure off almost of being like, I find I just like
Claire (1:00:54)
Yeah, that's great. I love that. Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Mm.
Lauren (1:01:16)
usually use like that enchantress energy in my loteal phase of just being like, well who cares? And just like posting and like throwing my phone and being like, whatever. Like, I'm going for a walk. Like I'm going out in the real world. I find that works for me to be like, okay, and then I'm gonna go do something real, like be with a friend. I don't need to be online and being like, is anyone reading it? Is every anyone watching it?
Claire (1:01:25)
Yep. Mm-hmm.
smart. That's really smart. Yeah, I think there's something again here around the identity piece that we spoke about earlier as well, because
Lauren (1:01:43)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:01:45)
I it can feel so vulnerable and very tender to start sharing your message publicly and to be talking about something that you're really passionate about, to be sharing your offerings, to be, you know, talking about the product that you have to share or whatever it is in your marketing. I will say here that and this is to everyone, myself included, marketing is a huge part of owning a business.
And if you want to sell something, you wanna invite people to your workshop or to your women's circle or to come and do some coaching with you or take a training or a course or buy your book or whatever it is that you do, whatever your magic is, whatever your creative gift is, your service to the world, you're gonna have to market it. Like we all do. And I think for me, recognizing that.
And understanding that marketing is actually quite a large percentage of what it means to run a business has actually been very freeing for me. Because I think for some time I held a belief similar to this one, that it was somehow below me, that really what my job was to do is to be a great coach, a great practitioner, a great teacher, and a great writer. And that actually marketing was somehow like I was somehow
superior and I didn't have to do marketing if I just did my job really well. Now look, recommendations are great, word of mouth referrals are great, those things are all great. But the reality is that we need to market our work. We need to be talking about it. And unless we're in a position or we have the desire to hire a team of copywriters, photographers, brand strategists, social media managers, the the job's probably falling to us. Like as self employed
Lauren (1:03:40)
Yeah.
Claire (1:03:42)
People, we wear so many hats. Like I wear all the hats basically in my business. Some I don't, but most I do. And owning the fact that some days of the week I am head of marketing, that's my job, has actually been really freeing. And I think then it helps a little bit with that fear of the cringe, because it's like, this is my job. This is a part of my job. And another thing that's helped me here is reframing marketing as simply sharing my message.
You know, like my passion and my calling in my career is to share menstrual cycle awareness with the world. That's it. And so I can do that through running cycle coach school. I can do that through client sessions or teaching workshops, but I can also just simply do it through my marketing. And I can think about it as an opportunity for me to to share something that I'm really passionate about. And it's part of the work, it's part of the calling. ⁓
I think those two mindset shifts the fact that marketing is a just a part of running a business and it's quite a large part. And marketing is, you know, it can be you sharing your message, doing, you know, answering your soul's calling if you want to think about it like that. that help that's helped me a lot.
Lauren (1:04:58)
Mm. Yeah, I love that. And I think of some advice I received from a friend because I was chatting about how I get so burnt out marketing myself. And she's like, How can you ritualize it? How can you make it fun? And I think even that word of cringe, like maybe your perfect brand of cringe is actually your calling card because it shows your personality. It shows your whimsy or whatever it is. And it actually will resonate. Like that's
Claire (1:05:09)
Mm.
Lauren (1:05:26)
How I meet clients is when I'm like uniquely myself and a bit silly and a bit loud, and people are like, I love your energy. I want to work with you. Like, so if someone's presence online is like not sitting with with you, then you probably won't want to work with them. And that's okay. Amazing. They'll find other people to work with. But then you will find someone who's like goofy like you, and you'll be like, fun. Let's like work together. Let's figure it out or whatever it is.
Claire (1:05:36)
Mm-hmm.
Uh-huh.
Lauren (1:05:53)
So just kind of owning that a bit, I think. But I love really like carving out space in your week to wear that hat, I think is brilliant advice.
Claire (1:06:02)
Our next question is from Phoebe. It's a goodie. I don't want to be on social media. I disagree with it as a way of communicating.
Lauren (1:06:12)
Mm.
Claire (1:06:13)
What are your thoughts on this?
Lauren (1:06:14)
Yeah. I mean, you were Clara, maybe I'm Phoebe. Cause I often think of like, I would love to just go back, analog, get off my phone and go into the woods and just, yeah, scream into the moss a bit. and I think it's hard because social media has kind of skewed away from the social element at times. So what's helped me a little bit.
Claire (1:06:24)
Mm.
Lauren (1:06:41)
Two parts. I think part one would be going onto social media and kind of infusing my own social element to like finding what your friends are doing, commenting, you know, like creating those conversations yourself, putting that energy out into the world of being like, I see what you're doing, and I'm celebrating that because that's what you want in return, I think, in my mind, because I that's how I struggle with social media sometimes, is I liken it to like screaming into the void a bit, where I'm like, is anyone
hearing what I'm saying. and then finding what works for you. So for me, like, yeah, I I struggle creating reels or, you know, small content. So that's why I've gone back to writing on Substack. And like I said, I don't remember if it was hit before we hit record or not, but
Claire (1:07:27)
Mm.
Lauren (1:07:33)
coming out of this mat leaf, like I have always been a writer. So I'm like writing my way out of that darkness of being like, I don't know what I want my business to look like anymore. Like since having a baby girl, she's like shattered my whole concept of self. So in a beautiful way and kind of refocused my passion on just like menstrual cycle awareness and like the periods in the body and and so just allowing myself to write and to
post that and if anything, that's connected me more with people because that's my that's my gift is the written word. And so putting that out with no purpose necessarily, no like clear like I am marketing for this has connected me with so many people. And and so if anything, like I think sometimes we have to think beyond just like that launch period of that's the purpose for social media. It's like, no, it's
Claire (1:08:04)
Mm.
Yeah.
Lauren (1:08:28)
It is to exchange ideas and it look what a beautiful gift that we live in a time where the internet exists and we can like work with more than the five people in our community that want our services, you know? so finding just like going to the gym and finding what works for you with physical exercise, what works for you with social media, because I think it is unfortunately ⁓ or fortunately, a key element of business today.
Claire (1:08:55)
Yeah, what you're saying is reminding me of something I shared actually with a of the current trainee on a supervision call this week. I think this
There's so many ways to answer this question. one of the things I can offer is that, yeah, there are different kinds of marketing. Like you say, there is like direct marketing where we really are like selling, selling something. And I think the trap can be to think that that's all we're there on social media to do is to just be constantly selling and and inviting people to experience our magic all the time.
Lauren (1:09:06)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:09:30)
And that that's a really quick pathway to burning out on social media, I think, if if you think that that's what you're there to do all the time is just always selling. Like in marketing, there's there's a coup there's two the way I see it, two different kinds of marketing. There is direct selling, which is really important to do. And there's probably going to be periods in the year where you are in launch mode or enrollment periods where you're directly inviting people to join something or sign up, right? And then there's other
Lauren (1:09:57)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:10:00)
more like wal you know warmer marketing that is more like ki yeah building connection like you say nurturing relationships sharing more of you know who you are and what it is that you do being creative like talking about the thing like I said earlier sharing your passion for whatever your in you know your topic is your niche your industry your client whatever it is that you love like bringing that forward in in your
marketing and in your creative expression. And that actually I think is probably like the bulk of what we're doing most of the time. The direct selling periods are really important. it's probably where most of your revenue comes in. But they're more effective when we've been doing the other stuff. Like, you know, if we're just showing up just to sell and then we go quiet and then we're coming back to sell, that doesn't feel that good for me anyway. And it doesn't feel that fun. and it probably not for your community either.
Lauren (1:10:43)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:10:55)
So I think it's worth probably thinking about like what yeah, like what do you want to use social media for? If you don't want to be on there, then it's possible that it is actually a values misalignment. Like I will say, you don't have to be on social media. Plenty of people have successful businesses without being on it. I agree with you that in 2026 and and for the foreseeable.
Lauren (1:11:13)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:11:21)
Probably, yes, social media is going to be an a part of especially having an online business, a big part of that. It can be a great tool. But you also don't have to be on there. So you you know, you can give yourself permission to not use it. And I'll speak in just a moment about what some of those other options might be, or to use it very infrequently. Like Lauren said earlier, I'm very familiar with taking months.
Lauren (1:11:27)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:11:49)
at a time off socials because I share your concerns. who was this question from Phoebe? Phoebe, or is it Lauren? Like, I really share your concerns. I get it, Meg. Like, you know, we don't have to think too deeply to think about all the ways in which social media and the companies who own the platforms that we're using might be out of integrity with our own values. Like
I get it. It's really tough in modern life to make choices that are always values aligned. And it might be it might be for you that social media is not gonna be in your wheelhouse, in which case, other things to think about include, like we've both mentioned Substack a couple of times. everyone should have a newsletter. Like whether you want to use social media or not, get a newsletter going. podcasting.
Think about long form content. YouTube is having a real resurgence right now. Now nothing's perfect, right? So yeah, I think we have to pick like, well, which platforms do we feel more aligned with? where where do our creative gifts shine? And how can we use use those creative gifts to reach the people that we want to work with? And where are they hanging out? Where are they spending time? So
Yeah, again, I have a lot of compassion for this question and I get it. you don't have to be on it. Really, you don't. And I think for me, I know that I put most of my creative effort into my long form content, whether that's this podcast here with Lauren and our guests, whether that's on my Substack or sending my newsletter. And then everything that goes onto socials is like,
is like overflow from that. So it might be a reel from a podcast episode, or it's a caption that comes from a newsletter, or it's a carousel that I've created from an essay. So I ensure that I'm not pouring all of my creative energy into social media because that's one of the gripes I have with it is that it's a total sucker. It's a total vortex. So I know that everything that is published on social media, you know, 90% of it is actually coming from a creative
like a more long form creative output that has more like longevity somewhere else.
Lauren (1:14:07)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I love that idea of basically just like pulling snippets from something that brings you joy. So if you love writing, like then just creating small content from that versus like staring at Instagram being like, What now? Like do what you love first. I even like have made, you know, physical collages and then you just photograph that and people are like, look how whimsical you are. And you're like, Thank you. ⁓ But it's just like
Claire (1:14:16)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm.
Lauren (1:14:37)
Simple, simple. Like I it's real life. And like I think people like like we said, there's that difference between direct selling and indirect selling. ⁓ so I think you can have more fun in that indirect phase of just sharing your life, sharing what you like, even if it isn't menstrual cycle awareness specific. That's what people resonate with. That's what people like makes people want to buy from you specifically, are the like nuances to your personality of just like what you love. Yeah.
Claire (1:14:39)
Yes.
Yeah.
The risk of being a bit of a challenger. because I got this question on social media and I know that this person is therefore using social media and no shade. Like I asked the question on social media, I get it. I get the tension, you know, of of values here. I do want to say, is this
Lauren (1:15:20)
Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:15:27)
resistance to marketing and is this a real like fear of being seen that is being disguised as like having principles around social media? I'm just gonna put that out there and sit with it. Because I can be honest and say that for me, I know that that sometimes comes up. It feels really good to be off social media for months and months and months and not having to market anything.
Lauren (1:15:40)
Mm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Claire (1:15:54)
And that again, like that protective mechanism can be useful for a little while. And I know that for me it can really lead into actually I feel like I'm hiding a bit. But I'm saying, well, again, I have this like, you know, I don't need to use that. and that doesn't, that's not actually in service to me or my work at all.
Lauren (1:16:03)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Or is it
And once again to connect to that theme of community, is it something that you need help with? And can you ask someone for help? Because I know I've been meaning to text you, Claire, for a long time to ask, how do you make the little quotes on Substack that you share in the feed? Because I don't know how to do that.
Claire (1:16:20)
Totally. Yeah.
Lauren (1:16:30)
You know, moments like that where you're like Thank you. But just like yeah, maybe do you just need help and do you want to just like have a friend come over and make some rules with you? Just be silly about it.
Claire (1:16:30)
I'll I'll make you a little tutorial. Mm-hmm. You're welcome.
Yeah.
I love that. I love
that idea of doing of doing it with somebody else. Yeah, definitely. And look, yeah. Make it fun.
Lauren (1:16:48)
Get dressed up.
Have a cacao.
Yeah. Be whimsical. Yep.
Claire (1:16:53)
Make it fun.
I think for me, definitely pouring all my energy, my creative energy into other ⁓ yeah, like other aspects that have more longevity has has n nurtured a part of my soul that really needed nurturing. When I feel like I'm pouring everything into Instagram, that doesn't feel great. and you know, it's it's it's like
Strategy as well. Like be smart about it. The truth is that not everybody does see everything on Instagram. People have very short attention spans over there. So the reality is you don't have people's attention for very long. Great. Go somewhere else where you where you can, where they're going to listen to an hour-long podcast episode or a 20-minute YouTube video, or they're gonna sit and read your essay and get into the comments section. Like brilliant. Go and and pour your creative gift somewhere else. And then if the overflow happens to come onto social media.
Fantastic. We have one question left.
Lauren (1:17:45)
Yeah.
Yeah. Is that from Fiona? Yeah. Yes, I would love to. Thank you. Thanks for sending in a question, Fiona. She asks, Too many ideas that are spread all over the place and don't get put out there because then I'm busy again as a reason why she's not showing up or feeling afraid to be seen.
Claire (1:17:50)
This one's from Fiona. Yeah, do you want to read this one out?
Now I witnessed Lauren reading out a list of ideas that she had at Hampstead Heath in London a few years ago. I think it maybe took about five to ten minutes probably to hear this list of of ambitions that this woman had for her life. So I'm gonna let you answer this or at least begin to answer this one.
Lauren (1:18:35)
I forgot about that.
Yes, I am somewhat that was well and funny tying that back to the chat you had with Vienda because it was through a course of hers where she was like, write down all of your deepest desires. And then that was question one and I was just there for like 20 minutes and I was like, what else are we supposed to be doing? And I've yeah, I've I've definitely realized that maybe that's a superpower of mine is having many ideas of what I should be doing. And
Claire (1:19:07)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (1:19:08)
It can feel quite overwhelming. And I would say that's when I lean into my cycle most, because my brain, I would say 80% of the time is very that inner spring energy, you know, when you're like coming out and like estrogen hits and then your brain's like, Bah! Here's everything I've ever wanted to do. And you're just like, What path am I following? What thread am I grabbing? And I'm definitely quite the introvert, I would say. I
Resonate deeply with the hermit card. The terra, just like I often say I would love to like go into the woods and just lie face down in the moss for, you know, hours on end. And so that second half of the cycle, that lutile phase, that winter, that's where I feel most powerful, I would say. Really leading into like that metal element of autumn and
Claire (1:19:40)
Mm.
Lauren (1:20:01)
really visioning like almost like a sword of just being like, okay, what do I actually have time for? Protecting my energy and tapping into that crone as well of like when I'm bleeding, when I am like, I have nothing left to give. What's actually exciting me? And I think it was you probably in the training who is like, can you bleed on it? Can you bleed on this decision? And yes, maybe a new project that feels shiny and new doesn't feel like a decision that you need to bleed on, but it probably is. And it's just like
Claire (1:20:27)
Mm.
Lauren (1:20:30)
I think when you're starting your business, there can be so many shiny things. I know I did the fertility awareness training. Do I want to teach that? No, but I did it because I was like, I need to add to my arsenal. And then it's just like, okay, what are we doing? Like, so I I I appreciate the shininess. I even debated doing like that like nutrition course that I know so many people have done about like eating with your hormones. And I'm just like, maybe I should add that. And then it's just like, stop, stop, stop, stop. Finding that.
voice, finding where in your cycle you feel most yourself and that can be unique to you. So like I said, for me it's in that like pre-menstrum like phase where I'm connecting with my enchantress that I feel most myself and most clear on what I want to protect and what I want to teach. I think because that matriarchal revolution is like that core, that core pillar of fire in
everything that I do that that's what I want to create in my business. And so I can carve everything else out that's not meant for me. And so yeah, I would suggest if you are feeling a bit all over the place. And like I said, I have a million ideas for myself that I do want to do in my lifetime. And just realizing what you have the capacity for, what season you're in right now, like I of course I would love to publish a book. Am I going to have the time right now? Maybe not.
Claire (1:21:36)
Mm.
Lauren (1:21:57)
And that's okay. I know it's gonna happen. I can confidently put it to the side and know that it'll be ready to pick back up when the time is there. I feel like that was a big answer, but yeah, it's it's so layered and nuanced, and I definitely feel for Fiona because I I ⁓ I am her. She is me. These are all my questions.
Claire (1:22:09)
Hm.
Lauren (1:22:24)
Yeah, I would love to hear from you too, because I I just feel like, yeah, you have such a clear business now, but what was it like when you were starting before this world even really existed?
Claire (1:22:24)
Yeah, I I love
Hmm. Yeah.
I definitely resonate with the idea of having or with having a lot of ideas. I think it comes in seasons for me. I'm definitely in one right now where I have a lot of ideas, like a lot. And that comes in waves because then I have seasons where I have none. And it's like I'm in this winter void phase where there's like, hmm, or very much a void phase of like, I have no ideas.
Do I have any creative ambition anymore? Where have they all gone? And then, you know, and then it will come again. So I think there's something, yeah, very true, like you say, about ⁓ being in, you know, the season that you're in. I also think that I know for myself, I'm really good with beginnings and I'm really good with starting projects. Like that feels very easy for me, very natural. So that kind of winter to spring.
No problems. I have no issues initiating something and getting it off the ground. I know not everyone has that strength, but that is one I have. Where I struggle is finishing s finishing things and bringing them to completion and staying with it, like staying with the editing process in an essay, refining a course and not starting a brand new one. Like it and so that has been the season that I've had to really flex my creative muscles is getting better at endings.
Ending a tr ending the training, like closing something, closing a coaching container. These are all like more edgy for me. So I do wonder if Fiona might have a similar like she's very good at idea generation. There's a lot of things there that are just dating, but there's obviously some challenge here around, yeah, decision making. Like you said, Lauren, I think that's a really good one to bring in that bleeding bleed on it practice, which is the lineage for that is ⁓ to Red School for
naming that practice of like going into menstruation with an intention to get clarity on something. And that's a really good that's a really good practice to do. and then coming out of your bleed with, you know, ideally a bit more clarity on where you're going to focus your attention for the next cycle and really working with your menstrual cycle here. So using that spring phase to begin to move forward on some stuff.
Knowing that you're not going to action everything. So being really discerning and choosing what you will be pouring your energy and attention to in that cycle. I would also offer the question of what are you avoiding by by constantly generating new ideas and staying in that winter spring phase? Because that is by its nature quite a like internal time. It is really about
Gestating ideas, naming them, writing them down, brainstorming, researching, that's all really fun, but it doesn't actually involve anyone seeing what you have been up to and having to get any kind of feedback on it. So what is it that you're avoiding by not moving into the summer of that project and actually bringing it to life? And so then what would it look like to choose just one of your ideas? Just like pick one.
And to then commit to it either for just one full season, like s like spring as in in the year, so a few months, or maybe even six months. And so especially as we're here at the solstice right now, for anyone who has loads of ideas, things that they going, God, it's mid year and there's all these ideas I had at the beginning of the year that I haven't yet executed or taken action on. Could you just pick one? Like literally just bleed on it, pick one, circle it, and then what would it
be like to experiment with committing to seeing that through its summer and and bringing it to life at just as an experiment to see like what comes up for you even, what feels edgy about that. what might you be avoiding by not giving yourself over to the create to the full creative process.
Lauren (1:26:30)
Yeah. And even marking it to be like, okay, from this solstice to the next, like six months. What does that feel like? I also Yeah, just feeling that solstice energy around the theme of being seen, that theme of like ceremony almost. So it's like maybe for the summer solstice folks, it could be, you know, what are we stepping into? What do we want to be? What do we want to step into the light about? Like, is there a new identity that we want to like announce? Is there like
Claire (1:26:31)
Yeah.
Love that. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Lauren (1:27:01)
Something we need to celebrate and you know, even having a party. I think we have parties for everything, for weddings, for babies and for birthdays. It's like, is there something that you want to celebrate about your business and about this scary new chapter you're starting? Because I would bet your friends want to celebrate you. and then maybe on the winter side, is there a part of yourself that you're ready to let go of, to bury? Like, is there a story that you're telling yourself over and over again that you're ready to
Claire (1:27:06)
Mm.
yeah. Mm-hmm.
Lauren (1:27:31)
you know, lay to rest. there might be a yeah, a bit of a shedding ceremony and I think there could be fire involved involved in both, whether it's a celebration or a release. but really using this midpoint as a point of change and a point of celebration that you're worthy of being seen as you are. Mm-hmm.
Claire (1:27:53)
Mm-hmm. Yeah,
you are absolutely. We need your magic. We need your message, your voice. Like the calling that you have on your heart to share your gifts is so real and it's important. And you know, we're not here for long in this life. So embrace the cringe. Take a take a look at your you know.
Lauren (1:28:14)
Ha ha.
Claire (1:28:19)
Where you might be tying some of your output to worthiness, have a like a think about the identity that you're moving into. Where are some of your fears of rejection or being judged, showing up in the ways, you know, like what's underneath what's blocking you from getting out there and and getting your voice heard because it's normal. It's totally normal. I want you to know that whatever is stopping you is totally human. We get it.
Lauren (1:28:46)
And don't go it alone.
Claire (1:28:48)
Don't go to learn. Yeah.
Lauren (1:28:50)
Find a friend
makes it so much easier.
Claire (1:28:52)
Yeah.
This has been really fun recording with you, Lauren. I'm so glad that we were able to do this for the solstice. I'm wishing everyone a very merry solstice, winter or summer. We are enrolling, like I said, until the end of June for anyone who wants to be certified by the end of 26. Enrolments will stay open after that, but if you want to be certified by the end of this year and you know, be able to go out into your work.
Lauren (1:28:56)
Yeah.
Mm.
Claire (1:29:23)
with more depth and credibility and feeling confident that you've got the backing of our school then nah you've got until the end of June to enroll. There's so much exciting stuff coming up at the school in the next six months. Like I said, I've got ideas everywhere, but yeah, we've got quarterly office hours that we're kick starting soon, which is going to be for self-study trainees and also alumni, which is really exciting. We've just finished one lot of practice coaching calls, but we'll be doing more in the
Autumn, Northern Hemisphere Autumn, and ⁓ a few other little things that I won't share just yet because they're very much still in this the tender early spring stage.
Lauren (1:30:04)
Yeah, so maybe that's the the idea you want to circle. ⁓ the solstice that you want to commit the next six months to. Maybe you want to be a cycle coach by the new year. Who knows? Could be magical. Brilliant.
Claire (1:30:09)
Mm.
Maybe. Cool. Thank you
for listening, everybody. We'd love to hear your feedback on this episode. And if you enjoyed it, please share it with a friend. yeah, and come and continue the conversation with us over on social media. Bye.
Lauren (1:30:27)
Mm-hmm. Great opportunity to
be social. Bye.
Thank you so much for listening!
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